Decaflon

You obviously don't need one.

I finally left the windows world after one to many tussles with windows itself, and I was a microsoft solutions provider. There is a lot of shoddy hardware out there that can cause headaches as well. I wanted something I didn't have to worry about, and didn't have to constantly fight to keep secure, and running.

It's been nearly 3 years now. I still have that same mac (typing this reply on it,) plus a macbook. It's not been 100% perfect, I've run into half a dozen things that bothered me or gave me a problem, but I've resolved them all... and I was running into that weekly in the windows world. When I go to use my friend's windows machines I have to wonder what the heck I was doing all that time.

I don't think macs are for everyone, but I can't imagine going back. It's a jarring difference at first, and you will have trouble doing things because you are trying to make them too complicated--it's what you're used to. If you want to use it for getting work done I've not seen anything better. If you want to tinker with something linux and windows are where you should be.

Linux uber alles!!! Don't leave just when it's starting to get exciting!

Spend $400-600 jazzing up your desktop (new mobo, core 2 duo, couple of gigs of ram, medium-low-end graphics card for accelerated eye-candy).

Then spend another $100 on a new case, psu and whack your old bits in that to act as a media server, file-server, whatever =). Optionally add some silent+/passive cooling solution to make a lovely little media centre.

And then get an EeePC, though I might hold off on that for a bit because they're bring out a new bigger model which you'll have a much easier time typing on.

You obviously don't need one.

Very, very true. But this isn't about need, it's about want. To be fair, I'm also still using (whenever I can) my old Dell Inspiron 8000. (650mhz PIII, 196MB RAM, 20GB HD, running PuppyLinux.) I've just always wanted a Mac and finally I'm getting to the point where I can afford one and not feel like I'm breaking the bank.

@Oli: As for the EeePC, if I go that route, I'll hold off. I've been using Linux since... 1999. (Wow. Almost 10 years.) But, it sort of feels like time for a change already. And, as I said, I've been wanting a Mac since I was in college. (I still remember installing Linux on my roommate's iMac. He hated me for it. "WHAT'S THIS COMMAND LINE SHIAT?!" he lovingly yelled... Those were the days.

Philosophically and ideologically, I want to stick with what I have, meaning that I'd get the EeePC as a travel computer. (The Inspiron no longer has battery, and to get a new one would cost me at least $140.) However, I feel the pull of vanity tugging at me like lust a wayward lover. And vanity takes residence at the Apple store. (Or Amazon.)

Edit: Think about this question as a Linux vs. Mac debate. ;-)

I say if you want one, go for it. It will bring you hours of pleasure.

I say if you want one, go for it. It will bring you hours of pleasure.

That's the biggest selling point for NOT getting one.

Hours? I've been having a blast on my Macs since 1987...

Hell I still have a FULLY FUNCTIONAL Mac Classic in my bedroom.

Gnorb, if you can't find a reason to buy something other than "just because", I'd say you're doing fine without it.

Spend $400-600 jazzing up your desktop (new mobo, core 2 duo, couple of gigs of ram, medium-low-end graphics card for accelerated eye-candy).

Then spend another $100 on a new case, psu and whack your old bits in that to act as a media server, file-server, whatever =). Optionally add some silent+/passive cooling solution to make a lovely little media centre.

See, now, this totally defeats the purpose for me. I'm pretty much done with my computer hacking days. I'd rather spend my time writing, and I'd rather just work with something which "Just Works", something that I can't necessarily say with Linux. (I hate to say that because the fact is that for 95% of what I do, Linux "Just works". It's that 5% -- making sure that printers have the correct drivers, installing ndiswrapper to make the network card work properly, making sure that the video drivers don't accidentally burn up the screen when going into sleep mode, trying to find a Linux-compatible version of software which, while free, will take me an hour to properly set up (here's when I love Java) -- that makes me think "You know, an elegant, single solution, even if restrictive, would allow me to do what I need to get done."

Gnorb, if you can't find a reason to buy something other than "just because", I'd say you're doing fine without it.

Good point. Great point, in fact. Here's what I've come up with after thinking through it some more:

If I go the "here's what I have" route (desktop PC and laptop, which will likely be replaced by an Eee-PC), then I have 2 older computers, to work on, one of which (the laptop) which works pretty frigg'n slow unless I use barebones-style software (PuppyLinux works super fast on the laptop, and Gentoo... well, anything you compile will usually be fast, even if it takes 2 days to compile *cough*OpenOffice*cough*), the other which will have me tied to my desk.

With the iBook, I get the best of both worlds: a computer that's fast enough for my needs and something I can carry around with me when I want to work at the cafe, or bookstore, or library, or porch, instead of my desk (not to mention something which "just works; more than once have I hated plugin hell with Firefox on Linux). As for the cost, it's more than just money. It's freedom. As a non-programmer, not having the source code isn't the end of the world to me, but I've been caught too many times by the whole "Oops! Company closed, your standard is no longer supported. You're screwed" scenario. (And don't get me started with the garbage that came out of Microsoft with Word 2007.) Open source means that scenario is pretty much non-existent, and I *like* having the code. (Then again, standards compliance sort of guarantees the same thing.)

So there you go, there's what I'm thinking about. That's why the whole discussion's come to mind. I'm wondering whether my adherence to philosophy (free software) has cost me needlessly in productivity in my chosen path (writer).

Hmm...

Well also, with the Intel Macs you CAN run Vista/XP, OS X and Linux on them all on their own partitions and OS X can run X11 and on and on and on....

Yeah, I'm pretty much done dual-booting. Did that for years. I'm trying to consolidate to ONE platform in which to do everything with, and it ain't Windows.

ONE platform in which to do everything with, and it ain't Windows

I'm with you there...

I'd say when the laptop is too slow for you to bother using it, or something breaks, that's when you make your switch. Many of the reasons you list were mine as well. In highschool I built computers for people. In '94 I helped people install slackware linux at install parties. Up till the late 90's I had half a dozen computers in various states of repair in the basement. I had fun, learned a lot, those days are gone.

Now when I sit down at a computer, I expect it to do what I want it to, when I want it to, without having to fight it.

I'd say when the laptop is too slow for you to bother using it, or something breaks, that's when you make your switch.

It's called squeeeeezing the life out of your hardware. I'm sure you know the feeling quite well ;-) And there's always a special thrill at using old hardware productively with newer software, one of the things I love about Linux.

Of course, I was the guy still trying to use 386's and 486's I got for $5 at garage sales in 1997. (OS/2! Woooooo!)

Talk about loving the retro stuff, I also enjoy pulling this bad boy out every once in a while and loading up an old text based adventure game... (you have no idea how many times I've busted my wife, tying to throw him in the trash)

If it ain't broke, don't fix it. :)

You can dodgy 90% of Linux hacking straight away by shopping smart. Get well supported hardware like an Intel chipset with onboard Intel 3d and you'll have very few issues because it's all open source hardware with drivers that should be included with most distributions.

I feel your point about apps. I'm certain you're aware that the situation is improving mammoth amounts every few months. I know that statement doesn't "just work" but it might serve as some sort of incentive to save the pennies.

Don't know where I'm going with this so I'm going to shut up now.

I'd love to have a NeXT cube, but it's too frivolous for me to actually buy one.

That's the biggest selling point for NOT getting one.

Why? I've gotten at least 52,594 great hours out of mine.

So, wait... you've gotten 144 years of use out of yours?

Damn. That's... impressive.

[Edit: Holy ***... forgot my math. Bad. Didn't divide by "24 hours" just "365 days".]

Ozone, they had NeXT cube labs in the Math building when I was in college. I'd buy one in a second if I happened across one.

Wait, no. Shit. Let me recalculate that.

Gnorb you need to do your math again.

Err... Yeah, nevermind. Wow. I forgot to divide by 24.

I'll blame the coffee crash. Yeah, that's it.

I'm pretty much done with my computer hacking days. I'd rather spend my time writing, and I'd rather just work with something which "Just Works", something that I can't necessarily say with Linux.

You just sold yourself a Mac right there. That is the same reason I bought myself a MacBook. I work in desktop support by day and was tired of fighting and hacking my PC at night. Ever since I've done nothing on the mac but code, write, and photoshop.

Hack-free enjoyment. You won't ever look back. And besides, the Linux PC doesn't have to go totally unloved. Use it as a backup or media machine. It can have a good life.

Ditto to everyone. I love my MacBook. I got it after my Dell crapped out after 12.5 months. I'm not kidding. And I'm never going back.

Just did a pricing comparison between the MacBook and the Dell 1420 N with Ubuntu 7.10. Total price difference between the two for comparable products? Dell was about $160 cheaper.

Hmm.

You're trying to compare a free version of Ubuntu to the $120 dollar price tag of Mac OS X? Also, don't forget about iLife. Not to mention the resale value of a Mac is much better than that of Dell.

If getting a Macbook or whatever doesn't seem to fit your budget then don't sweat it, but if you've been going this long with old hardware, what's another 6 months or so to save up for one?

best reasons to go ahead:
you've been wanting one for ages
you can afford it more now
you want something that just works
your other machines are getting old and cumbersome
you're ready for change

at this point, i've not seen you really explore the reasons for NOT getting one. it sounds like you really want to do it, but i'm not sure what's holding you back except, perhaps, habit.

as for comparing the dell laptop to a macbook, i have never had anything but bad luck with dell laptops and i gave up on those. (one of my old jobs went through dell laptops like ice cream in the sun) we have 4 mac laptops in the house, my ancient 1999 lombard which still runs nicely, a powerbook (my old machine which finally got too slow for graphics work), my partner's ibook and my new macbook pro. no real problems with any of them. of course, this is simply anecdotal, but it's enough for me to prefer mac to dell just on hardware issues alone.

and, if you decide you want to continue playing with ubuntu, buy parallels ... it's a nice program which will let you use another OS without doing actual partitions or dual-boot. you run parallels just like any other Mac program. i think this eases transition sometimes because you don't suddenly have to re-purchase all of your programs instantly, but can go at a more leisurely pace.

@ender: You're absolutely right on pretty much all your accounts regarding my reasoning (that it's more focused on whether I should get one, that something is holding me back. Well, was).

Regarding running Parallels, (1) actually, I ran Fedora, not Ubuntu and (2) most of the software I used is available in both platforms anyway, so I don't believe I'll be needing to run it. (I think the only thing that ISN'T available, and I may be wrong here, is Opera.) Also, I'm looking to limit myself to one platform. This may change in the future, but it's where I foresee things going as of now.

As for Dells, I've always had pretty good luck with them and usually recommend them quite highly. Maybe it's just me, maybe just the way I wish to see them.

Anyway, as I alluded to before, I actually bought a MacBook. It's a refurb from the Apple store. 2.2GHz, 1GB RAM (expandable to 4), 120GB HD, DVD+R/DVR-R/CR-RW/C3PO...) Original price $1299, got it for $1099.

Now I'm in the hunt for good applications for writers for the Mac. I've heard of (and will be picking up) Scrivener, and I have a number of research-based plugins for Firefox, so... well yeah, that's where I'm at.

Thanks to all for your advice!

Doesn't seem like you need it but I'm a big fan of want as well.

You would definitely love the mac and I bet forget about all other options soon after!

:)

Get it Now and Enjoy your new home ;)

I love using a mac and I think Leopard is freaking awesome. But, I'm not sure if you know about this, but you can install OS X on your existing box. I'd say do this, use it for a while, kinda evaluate the OS, and then make a decision about buying a mac.

More info at http://www.insanelymac.com/

@timothyandrew: Nah. I've had enough of hacking around with computers, making things work half assed. Besides, I've used Mac OS X before, various times. Never for an extended period, mind you, but the experience is there.

Also, it arrived yesterday.

@shawndaddy: Sorry for not have noticed your comment before.

You're trying to compare a free version of Ubuntu to the $120 dollar price tag of Mac OS X?

Actually, my hardware comparison was to show that there was effectively a $40 difference between two similarly built systems, a difference that can easily be attributed to the technologies used within (for example, Apple's use of 802.11n as opposed to Dell's use of 802.11g). This meant that the perception that Apple's products are overtly expensive is a false one. (uUnless you start adding RAM. Then they're just plain wacky expensive. $700 extra for 4GB RAM? Err... No.)

Crucial.com has excellent ram for macbooks at a fraction of the price :)

Yeah, I've seen. I've also taken a look at Newegg. Currently my setup has 1GB and that seems to be doing OK, but, you know, 4GB of RAM is REALLY not something I would mind very much, though I'm not sure how much I need it right now.

@gnorb: Oh! Which one did you get?

13-inch MacBook, White. 2.2GHz, 120GB HD, 1GB RAM. I've detailed my first impressions here:

http://www.gnorb.net/apple/20080131/switch-made/

That's amazing. That's also the very same laptop I plan to buy in a few months. How is it so far? Also, because it has onboard graphics, do any movements seem choppy?

No choppy movements at all. Very smooth.

The one drawback I just discovered: The power adapter is WAY pricey: $80. And now I have to get one because my dog decided the old one was a chew toy.

That's good to hear. Sorry about your power brick though. By the way, did you run Photoshop or any other graphic intensive app? (Because that's my main point of contention between a Macbook and a Macbook Pro).

No, sorry. no photoshop. My graphic needs are fairly simple, and The GIMP is more than enough for my needs. However, I'm not sure whether this applies or not, but the MacBook only has 64MB of video ram (shared) whereas the MBP has a dedicated graphics card with more RAM, GDDR3.

Yes, I'm aware of that. I just wanted to know to what extent that affected performance on the macbook...

timothyandrew,

Photoshop isn't exactly a graphics intensive app... it just happens to work ON graphics intensively. You'll performance difference between cpu and ram upgrades.

Something like aperture or pixelmator you'll see improvements with an upgraded videocard, as they can leverage the GPU to do some of the crunching.

The new Macbook actually has 144MB of shared RAM, not 64MB.

Like the poster above said, if you do need a graphic editor, give Pixelmator a try. It's not photoshop but for the price and what it does it's pretty good.

*looks at the stats*

Hey, you're right! Sweet! (No wonder I feel like I should have more RAM. I'm planning on buying 4 GB from Crucial sometime soon.

Get one, a laptop.

It's clear that you can get by without one... as a writer, you really don't need it, but SURPRISE, Mac users do more with their computers than PC users do, and much more than Linux users do, because it is fun, and there are a million creative things that you can do, and you can enjoy doing, that would be a chore on other platforms.

Imagine a computer that enhances your life instead of simply complicating it.

I'm pretty much on your same situation, and decided to wait till I really get one.

However people keep telling me 'go get one man!', just as a prize you give yourself for all your hard work, even if you don't really need it.

@Gnorb
haha hell yeah! Just read you review and it reminded me of when I made the switch from windows to OSX. It's odd at first getting used to 'no right clicking' but now it's completely natural, when I use windows at work my first impulse is to CTRL/click :-)

I used to use Firefox all the time on OSX but I find it slow compared to Safari. I even un-installed extensions and cleared the cache but it still runs slow. Safari is nice though and so is Opera. Have you tried other browsers like iCab and Shira?